An unfortunate issue

Prah has seen or been told that the small fleet delivered to you (Jack) was bought from me.

I could have denied it but it seemed pointless as he isn't stupid and would start to doubt everything I said because of it. So I came clean, explaining the fleet was small, that you approached me after the KH attacked and made an offer I couldn't refuse. Me being overly worried about the likelyhood of the KH attacking me.

I said you would be in a position to buy a huge fleet from the spring anyway, so it didn't seem such an issue selling you a few. I also apologised.

Hopefully he bought it. I can't see him declaring war on me for it anyway. Then he'd have far less troops to send east anyway for that seems to be his entire goal being allied to Makedonia and the Getai.

Now he's talking about leaving. He feels Selucia is too strong and it's unfair.

Well that's a shame that it's come out now, will arouse everyone's suspicions a lot sooner than we'd wanted.

On Prah saying he might leave;
-Firstly, it's probably a good thing that he has found out now then, cus if we'd all suddenly attacked him in 6 turns time or so then he would probably would have walked straight away saying that it was unfair.
-Secondly, (and I say this knowing it wouldn't have been in my interest) The EFA could've pushed me to the very brink, I'm unsure whether they could've eventually won (then again I'm very arrogant ), but I was really on the ropes 2 turns ago, with the Saka invading Baktria and taking whatever they like, Parthia moving about my eastern half of the Empire at will, Pontos and Ptolemy's forces being joined together in Asia Minor, and with Prah having garrisoned every possible mountain pass or royal road into Pontos it left me in a tight spot. All it would've taken to really fuck up my plans would be for Hiersolyma or Side to be very well garrisoned. Just leaving a garrison of 5,000 each in these cities, or just 10,000 at Hiersolyma would've meant that if I wanted my Central Host to carry on moving south towards Egypt itself then I would've been taking horrendous losses in siege assaults or just rotting away outside the city walls waiting for surrender.
If the war was still going on (with the entire of the EFA, not just Saka and Parthia), then I'd still be in trouble, even after next turn's recruitment it wouldn't be much better, simply because 60% of my cash would have to be spent recruiting in Baktria to drive out the tens of thousands of Saka roaming around my lands. This would've only left me recruiting 10,000 or so fresh troops (and they wouldn't have been the best quality) for Seleukia, and combined Pontos/Ptolemy could've recruited at least that many. So, I think really it's not that the game is totally unfair to Pontos or Ptolemy I think they've just made some bad choices.
-Finally, does Prah not think of it from my point of view? Seemed pretty unfair to me when the whole world declared war on me, but the game is all about getting yourself out of tough spots and making shady deals. To be honest, all it would've taken to completely cripple me by this point would've bee for Prah & the allies to get Hayasdan on board. If they'd declared war on me as well, with their 25,000 good quality troops I would have been buggered.

Just pisses me off that he thinks the game's been unfair to him. Aside from you guys deciding to break away from Pontos and the EFA, the only lucky break I've had is that, due to player shortages, I've been able to hold on to Baktria. Imagine how unfair it would've seemed to me if Baktria had revolted at the same time Parthia did, there'd be very little hope for me.

Good point on his finding out now this issue with ships rather than an all out assault on him at some point in the future.

I do agree with you regarding his moaning about unfairness. That is why I made the Philosophy thread, just to emphasise that it's not about fairness at all. It's about using what you've got to pursue your own advantage just like is done in RTW. If you gain all well and good, but if you fuck up and are surprised when an ally or someone strikes at you, go down fighting with your last breath. Then take another free faction and try again.

I've had chats with LQ and the Epeiros situation. He finds the whole awful war position he's in a challenge. He will fight me to the last man. That is the type of attitude these games need. Try your best to win, but losing is just a breath away.

I hadn't even thought about the taking on new factions. Which makes it even more ridiculous imo to be moaning about fairness, if Pontos did go down then Prah could go to the Casse, or if Pontos went he could carry on as the Ptolemy or vice versa.

I really admire LQ's spirit, to be honest, I would have expected this moaning more from him than from Prah.

I really admire LQ's spirit, to be honest, I would have expected this moaning more from him than from Prah.

Same here.

When the KH first started moving I suddenly thought, shit I could conceivably lose if he's very smart and goes for it. But I knew there were other factions if all goes to fuck. But once I realised that the KH were being slow and tortoise like (a fatal mistake I feel) I regained my composure with my wobble thoroughly over.

The Kh should have smashed into my rear if he was/is pissed off at the war with Epeiros. now he's given away his concerns yet revealed he may not feel quite confident enough to go for me directly. Now I intend to surprise him ala Pearl Harbour once Epeiros is gone with a double envelopment by sea and a direct strike to hold his main forces in place or maybe even let him into Makedonia interior, thus allowing his forces to be cut off from supply as his cities fall behind him. Motherfucker!

ugh, i hate it when people threaten to leave

i agree with everything you have both said

LQ (who i've had nasty arguments with in the past) even sent me a PM saying no hard feeling about the war and that he enjoys the challenge. As involving as these games can be, especially when you invest so much time into your strategy, it can feel devastating when things dont go your way but you just got to get on with it, its a game. Its one of the reasons why my foot is off the gas a bit this game, it can get too much!

i wonder how he found out about the ships though? meh, who cares!

I haven't a scooby how he found out. He has no ships in situ at the moment though he could have had to see them, though they were placed intentionally out of the way. Ah, what the hell, in reality it would be hard to deliver a fleet to an enemy without someone finding out so in terms of realism it's fair enough.

Arkano did tell me Prah had talked about leaving before over some issue with the game.

but jack said it right, if anything, he's had it harder in the sense he's had so many enemies everywhere. To be honest, prah has been a shit campaigner and not done what would have been needed to be done in his position. He's had control of up to 3 of Jack's enemies at a time and could have really coordinated some shit that really could have been deemed unfair by Jack (one player controlling three nations against him!) He's started playing into the Sel's strengths instead of his own so it isn't about being unfair, its about being shit (is that too harsh lol?) he's had good opportunities and failed/

Pontos is deemed nigh impossible to play on EB. Rhudaur was deemed the same on the LOTR game, and we know the story there. Life isn't balanced, people are stronger than others. It's about working with what you've got.

Totally agree with you there.

Ditto.

Pontus has ended its alliance with Makedonia and reduced it to Non Aggression.

Prah has done the same with the Getai. Thermo I changed your relationship with him in turn. I hope that is ok, it just meant he'd see what we were up to.

Epeiros appears to also be in formal alliance with the KH.

Have you got any troops onboard ships to come to greece yet Jack?

Yer they're en route, but it's only about 4,000 soldiers, to be honest the ships will be probably end up being more useful than the division of soldiers they carry. Although there are some decent cavalry aboard. Still gonna be 2 turns though, they're only just passing Salamis. I would ally with you on the site, but that would pretty much confirm Prah's suspicions.

Two turns should be fine. At that point my other fleet should arrive at Antioch as well so another larger buyndle can get underway. That should tie in with your other ships and the loan arriving at Antioch too!

If the KH take their time and don't strike we might be in a perfect position to unleash an assault on that 4th or 5th turn.

Keep neutral on the website. Arakano has already asked if we are allied. He said there are rumours we are. I denied EVERYTHING!